1c_schelle
There was a new book being released today, Japanese Tales (http://www.foliosociety.com/book/JPT). Looks quite interesting, but another £75 book. Curiously it was released after the spring collection and befor a (possible) may collection.
In the comments to their twitter post they mention that there are 'only three new editions this time'.
Edited for information on additional books.
In the comments to their twitter post they mention that there are 'only three new editions this time'.
Edited for information on additional books.
2harvestRoad
I do wonder what places is at such a price? I cannot help but to want it though.
Also, "3 new editions this time" i guess that means 2 more are waiting and no incoming release of new books, which is all fine because the spring collection is awesome and Jap tales looks really good
Also, "3 new editions this time" i guess that means 2 more are waiting and no incoming release of new books, which is all fine because the spring collection is awesome and Jap tales looks really good
3LondonLawyer
On Instagram, the caption reads "although officially part of our upcoming Summer Collection, three new additions have been released early for you".
I wonder what the other two are.
I wonder what the other two are.
5NLNils
>3 LondonLawyer:
The Yangtze Valley and Beyond by Isabella Bird is one. £75.
http://www.foliosociety.com/book/YGV/yangtze-valley-and-beyond
The Snow Leopard by Peter Matthiessen the other. £36.95.
http://www.foliosociety.com/book/SNL/snow-leopard
The Yangtze Valley and Beyond by Isabella Bird is one. £75.
http://www.foliosociety.com/book/YGV/yangtze-valley-and-beyond
The Snow Leopard by Peter Matthiessen the other. £36.95.
http://www.foliosociety.com/book/SNL/snow-leopard
6gmacaree
I seem to remember Yangtze Valley and Beyond being proposed as a potentially LE. Will be getting all three of these regardless.
7dlphcoracl
This is a book I certainly intend to order when I eventually combine it with a few others. For FSD-ers interested in this genre, also look at 'Kwaidan' (Stories and Studies of Strange Things), a collection of twenty Japanese tales collected and edited by Lafcadio Hearn, published by the LEC in 1932. This is one of the most distinctive of the George Macy LECs.
8folio_books
The Snow Leopard looks interesting. It's a probable but I'll wait for the summer catalogue, having spent nearly £600 with Folio this morning. The other two just look expensive so they go on the "wait until they're in the sale" list.
9wdripp
All three books are of interest to me, but particularly Japanese Tales which looks gorgeous. The US price for it is $112, not much of a mark up at the current exchange rate, but quite high given it is a small volume and not a fine edition. Maybe they are charging extra for the ribbon?
10gmacaree
>9 wdripp: It's not cheap, but I'm not sure it's a small volume. Folio have it at 11"x7.25". Compare to, e.g. Ulysses at 11.5"x8"
11wdripp
>10 gmacaree: Ah. I think I was eyeing the depth rather than the other dimensions. Good to know!
I am sure it will be added to my library at some point. But at the current price and with no incentives to entice me, it will be a while I expect.
I am sure it will be added to my library at some point. But at the current price and with no incentives to entice me, it will be a while I expect.
12wdripp
I just got the email announcement about these books on the same day they were discovered by members of this group. That may be a first!
14coynedj
Three very enticing volumes. The summer collection could be an expensive one for me, despite my attempts to cut back on my buying as I (1) run out of space and (2) try to have some money in the bank for my retirement in a few years.
I have a hardcover copy of The Snow Leopard from when it was initially published several decades ago, before I acquired an FS addiction. I read it then and haven't revisited it, but I recall liking it quite a lot.
I read Isabella Bird's A Lady's Life in the Rocky Mountains (published by the FS in to 1980's, as I recall). It was very good, and this new offering (with a map included!) will be high on my list.
Japanese Tales does indeed look gorgeous.
I have a hardcover copy of The Snow Leopard from when it was initially published several decades ago, before I acquired an FS addiction. I read it then and haven't revisited it, but I recall liking it quite a lot.
I read Isabella Bird's A Lady's Life in the Rocky Mountains (published by the FS in to 1980's, as I recall). It was very good, and this new offering (with a map included!) will be high on my list.
Japanese Tales does indeed look gorgeous.
15NLNils
>13 folio_books: You’re welcome. I was curious myself and it was simple to share the results with all.
16affle
I quote from the email:
'Published in small numbers, these stunning new editions won't be available for long. Order now to avoid disappointment.'
Make of that what you will.
'Published in small numbers, these stunning new editions won't be available for long. Order now to avoid disappointment.'
Make of that what you will.
17gmacaree
>16 affle: I'm not sure how long I'll be able to resist. The more I look at the Bird the more it seems to be calling to me.
18bacchus.
Isn't this new as well?
http://www.foliosociety.com/book/BHW/behind-the-wall
Not familiar with older titles so maybe I missed it before.
http://www.foliosociety.com/book/BHW/behind-the-wall
Not familiar with older titles so maybe I missed it before.
19gmacaree
>18 bacchus.: No, released at the end of 2016
20folio_books
>16 affle: Make of that what you will.
Cynic that I am, mostly what I make of it is Readers Digest marketing-speak.
Cynic that I am, mostly what I make of it is Readers Digest marketing-speak.
21HuxleyTheCat
I've been asking Folio for The Snow Leopard at every opportunity for many years, so I'm delighted that they are going to publish it at last. The other two new books look very nice, too, and have been added to my wish list. As for >12 wdripp: I've received an email announcement of the new titles, along with the CUP History of Chinese Art at a very decent discount.
22HuxleyTheCat
>20 folio_books: Ditto.
23EclecticIndulgence
This message has been deleted by its author.
24folio_books
>21 HuxleyTheCat: I've been asking Folio for The Snow Leopard at every opportunity for many years
And Watership Down. Don't forget Watership Down.
In the meantime The Snow Leopard will do nicely.
And Watership Down. Don't forget Watership Down.
In the meantime The Snow Leopard will do nicely.
25wdripp
>23 EclecticIndulgence: Hm. I hadn't noticed that statement in the email. Hard to know if it is false advertising or not, but again I find myself wishing they used counters for low stock consistently so I could adjust my buying habits based on the availability of titles. I wonder if they are trying to avoid having to discount so many titles heavily in the sales.
26HuxleyTheCat
>24 folio_books: Indeed, I continue to live in hope for WD.
27kcshankd
Very happy to see The Snow Leopard, it is a book that sticks with you long after reading.
28Sorion
>27 kcshankd: I am as well. It’s long been in my suggestions box. I am however not sold on either the cover art or the photographic art. Will have to see it in hand.
29cronshaw
Yangtze Valley and Japanese Tales both appeal to me.
However, I don't quite understand why Japanese Tales with 8 colour plate images is £75 while Snow Leopard with 20 colour plates is £36.95. So far I see that the former is 1" taller, has a silver top edge and a hole in the slipcase (the blue of which clashes oddly with that of the beautifully designed boards). Does that justify an almost doubling of the price?
Though I'm disappointed in the dullness of the binding design for Yangtze, especially compared to Japanese Tales, and what I assume are plain endpapers, it's the one out of all three that's right now sitting in my basket.
However, I don't quite understand why Japanese Tales with 8 colour plate images is £75 while Snow Leopard with 20 colour plates is £36.95. So far I see that the former is 1" taller, has a silver top edge and a hole in the slipcase (the blue of which clashes oddly with that of the beautifully designed boards). Does that justify an almost doubling of the price?
Though I'm disappointed in the dullness of the binding design for Yangtze, especially compared to Japanese Tales, and what I assume are plain endpapers, it's the one out of all three that's right now sitting in my basket.
30affle
The marketing efforts for these books look a little better co-ordinated than is sometimes the case: the paper advertisements came today within 24 hours of the website and email appearances. The leaflets for all three increase the ordering itch.
The covering letter says: 'Many of our books are printed in small quantities so order soon to avoid disappointment.' (sic, in case you thought I'd left the comma out.) Not quite the same message as the quote at >16 affle:, but still FSBS, I suspect.
Edited to correct reference to earlier post.
The covering letter says: 'Many of our books are printed in small quantities so order soon to avoid disappointment.' (sic, in case you thought I'd left the comma out.) Not quite the same message as the quote at >16 affle:, but still FSBS, I suspect.
Edited to correct reference to earlier post.
31folio_books
>30 affle:
Yes, mine arrived today as well. I can't say I feel any more inclined to order, though. Not immediately, anyway. I'll wait for the May (ish) catalogue.
Yes, mine arrived today as well. I can't say I feel any more inclined to order, though. Not immediately, anyway. I'll wait for the May (ish) catalogue.
32elladan0891
>29 cronshaw: why Japanese Tales with 8 colour plate images is £75 while Snow Leopard with 20 colour plates is £36.95
Speaking of plates:
1) Japanese Tales also has 17 integrated black & white drawings
2) I suspect FS paid more to commission original illustrations than to simply reprint some photos from the 70s
Having said that, I never quite understood Folio pricing. What other factors are there? I doubt Matthiessen's rights cost less than Japanese Tales translator's (same chap that translated The Tale Of Genji, btw). Perhaps Snow Leopard's print run is significant enough for economies of scale to kick in? Who knows.
All I know is I really like all 3. Some prioritizing to do now..
Speaking of plates:
1) Japanese Tales also has 17 integrated black & white drawings
2) I suspect FS paid more to commission original illustrations than to simply reprint some photos from the 70s
Having said that, I never quite understood Folio pricing. What other factors are there? I doubt Matthiessen's rights cost less than Japanese Tales translator's (same chap that translated The Tale Of Genji, btw). Perhaps Snow Leopard's print run is significant enough for economies of scale to kick in? Who knows.
All I know is I really like all 3. Some prioritizing to do now..
33MobyRichard
>32 elladan0891:
I would guess it's the size of the print run. I wouldn't expect a huge audience for 'Japanese Tales,' but it seems
like the kind of book that if you want it, you $112 want it. Also, these aren't factory artists. I suspect this particular artist wanted a premium and got a premium for their unique work.
I would guess it's the size of the print run. I wouldn't expect a huge audience for 'Japanese Tales,' but it seems
like the kind of book that if you want it, you $112 want it. Also, these aren't factory artists. I suspect this particular artist wanted a premium and got a premium for their unique work.
34cronshaw
>32 elladan0891: you’re probably right. I’m unsure what value to apply to text-integrated monochrome drawings. I assume, as MobyR suggests, that the marketed 'small' print run would contribute. But then why not make it a numbered limited edition of a few thousand? Then customers would better know where cost and value lie.
35EclecticIndulgence
This message has been deleted by its author.
36narbgr01
I just placed my order by phone and Jack, with whom I spoke, confirmed that I will also receive a copy of one of the "mystery books". This availability in my understanding ends on May 5 and I made a point of asking about it; it was not volunteered.
37cronshaw
Reading the blurb for the Random House first edition of 'Japanese Tales' translated by Royall Tyler, I see that Folio have dropped 50 of the originally 220 tales in the work. It does annoy me when Folio cut a work in the process of making a 'fine' edition. Adding style to subtracted substance does not a fine edition make, at least not for me.
However, I am most definitely ordering Isabella Bird's The Yangtze and Beyond: 107 original photos, including some 'previously unpublished', and 'painstakingly reproduced by Folio to increase clarity and ensure consistency of tone', plus the 'larger', removable map, and introduction by Dervla Murphy, sound to me like solid, value-added substance, just the thing a fine edition ought to have.
However, I am most definitely ordering Isabella Bird's The Yangtze and Beyond: 107 original photos, including some 'previously unpublished', and 'painstakingly reproduced by Folio to increase clarity and ensure consistency of tone', plus the 'larger', removable map, and introduction by Dervla Murphy, sound to me like solid, value-added substance, just the thing a fine edition ought to have.
38EclecticIndulgence
This message has been deleted by its author.
39Jayked
Neither the website nor the press release describes it as a Fine Edition: "complements other titles in the Folio myths and legends collection..."
40cronshaw
>39 Jayked: At £75 for a volume of only 368 pages, twice the cost of standard Folio editions of the same length, the pricing is very much 'fine' edition. The binding and slipcase design have nothing in common with existing titles in the Folio myths and legends collection.
41bacchus.
As for the The Yangtze Valley and Beyond I got two images that are not on the website. You can see the endpapers at least if you're curious.




42cronshaw
>41 bacchus.: Many thanks for the extra images! I've already ordered my copy. 107 photos like the one in that frontispiece plus the removable map make this a must-have for me.
43folio_books
>40 cronshaw:
£75 definitely says "fine Edition" to me, even if they don't label it as such,
So .... £75 for a non-Fine Edition with nearly a quarter of the content missing doesn't seem like too much of a must-have. I'm not even sure about keeping it on the "waiting for a sale" list. Perhaps they're thinking of next year's Free Mystery Book.
£75 definitely says "fine Edition" to me, even if they don't label it as such,
So .... £75 for a non-Fine Edition with nearly a quarter of the content missing doesn't seem like too much of a must-have. I'm not even sure about keeping it on the "waiting for a sale" list. Perhaps they're thinking of next year's Free Mystery Book.
44SF-72
I find the subject matter and illustrations of Japanese Tales quite appealing, but can't believe the price tag in combination with what amounts to a heavily abridged book. (Thanks for the warning, Cronshaw.) This doesn't make me very keen to support that kind of publication. Their attempt to pressure people into buying it quickly because the edition is so small it will sell out soon also leaves a bad taste.
45Jayked
>40 cronshaw:
There is a generic resemblance with the 2 titles they mention -- African Folk Tales and Chinese Fairy Tales -- at double the price.
There is a generic resemblance with the 2 titles they mention -- African Folk Tales and Chinese Fairy Tales -- at double the price.
46dlphcoracl
"A cynic is a man who know the price of everything and the value of nothing."
-Oscar Wilde (Lady Windemere's Fan, 1892)
Sadly, one or two FSD members have had an infectious and deleterious effect on many other FSD-ers. They are pseudo-collectors of fine and private press books who value and evaluate books by what they cost per ounce, how many illustrations are included, etc. In reality, 'Japanese Tales' is one of the FS's better efforts and it indeed falls into the category of "fine FS edition", comparable to their Walden, Leaves of Grass, Piers Plowman, In Parenthesis, etc.
The binding is distinctive and deluxe, a beautiful wrap-around image in a fine blocked cloth. The slipcase has been die-cut so that the silvery moon on the front cover projects through it. Both binding and slipcase were designed by illustrator and artist Yuko Shimizu to form a unified whole. The top of the edge block is silver-lined (similar to the FS Ulysses), the endpapers are illustrated with a printed Japanese design, and the Shimizu illustrations are a league apart from the vast majority of FS books, specially commissioned for this Folio edition. The book has been crafted by one of the two top publishers employed by the FS - the LEGO S.p.A (Legatoria Editoriale Giovanni Olivotto), a family-owned enterprise with nearly 120 years of fine printing and publishing spanning five generations:
http://www.borsaitaliana.it/pro-link/emittenti/lego/lego.en.htm
The issue of this book containing "only" 170 of the 220 tales in the original collection is a non-issue (>37 cronshaw:, >44 SF-72:). If the FS had omitted 3 or 4 of the short stories in 'Dubliners' or 'The Door in the Wall' that would, of course, be inexcusable and detract considerably from each collection of short stories. However, in this collection of 220 tales there is wide variation in their quality, i.e., some are simply not very good. Having a knowledgeable and sympathetic editor cull this collection and select the best of these stories, omitting those of lesser merit, is a huge plus not a minus. Add in a long, informative essay by the translator and editor Royall Tyler which places the historical importance of these tales in context, which increases the literary value of this edition.
Suggesting that this is a suitable candidate as "next year's Free Mystery Book" (>43 folio_books:) would be laughable if it weren't so sad, a result of a pseudo-collector who equates aesthetic merit with price. Similarly, comparing this to 'African Folk Tales' and 'Chinese Folk Tales' - two generic FS books without any special qualities whatsoever (>45 Jayked:), is misguided. A far more accurate comparison (imho) is with the recent FS James Joyce editions of 'Ulysses' and 'Finnegans Wake' , in terms of size and scale of the book, the quality of the book design and illustrations, and the quality of printing and craftsmanship.
It is worth placing this book in the historical context of fine and private press editions of Japanese tales. This genre was first introduced to Western audiences by the storied Japanese publisher Takejiro Hasegawa (1853-1938). From 1885 through the mid-1920s he published French and English language editions of these Japanese tales in editions printed on a crepe-like paper and illustrated with Japanese wood block colour illustrations that are subtle and exquisite. They are also quite expensive, outside the reach of most FS collectors. The most famous (and expensive) of these collections is a 5-volume set translated by Lafcadio Hearn (who also edited the splendid LEC collection 'Kwaidan'), published in the 1920s by Hasegawa, routinely costing between $2,000 to $3,000 in collectible condition (see link). At the other end of the spectrum are a handful of generic trade books (Barnes & Noble, Borders, Waterstones, etc.) which serve the useful purpose of bringing these wonderful tales to a wider audience, but certainly not intended as collectible editions. This new FS edition fills an important collecting void, bringing some of the unique aesthetic qualities of the über-expensive Hasegawa editions to book collectors in a highly pleasing, affordable edition.
https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi=3846407745&clickid=widQKzV...
Finally, I am not insensitive to the issue of price. For many FS collectors this is a bit of a reach and they will have to wait 2 or 3 years, hope that the book is subsequently included in a future FS sale and discounted 20% to 30%, bringing it within monetary reach. Nothing wrong with that if that is what is required to acquire a beautiful and unique FS edition. However, please don't fall into the rabbit-hole being dug by a handful of cynical FS pseudo-collectors who can't afford this book, cannot understand or rationalize the price, and then proceed to backwards-rationalize that this edition simply "isn't very good."
Wrong. It is.
-Oscar Wilde (Lady Windemere's Fan, 1892)
Sadly, one or two FSD members have had an infectious and deleterious effect on many other FSD-ers. They are pseudo-collectors of fine and private press books who value and evaluate books by what they cost per ounce, how many illustrations are included, etc. In reality, 'Japanese Tales' is one of the FS's better efforts and it indeed falls into the category of "fine FS edition", comparable to their Walden, Leaves of Grass, Piers Plowman, In Parenthesis, etc.
The binding is distinctive and deluxe, a beautiful wrap-around image in a fine blocked cloth. The slipcase has been die-cut so that the silvery moon on the front cover projects through it. Both binding and slipcase were designed by illustrator and artist Yuko Shimizu to form a unified whole. The top of the edge block is silver-lined (similar to the FS Ulysses), the endpapers are illustrated with a printed Japanese design, and the Shimizu illustrations are a league apart from the vast majority of FS books, specially commissioned for this Folio edition. The book has been crafted by one of the two top publishers employed by the FS - the LEGO S.p.A (Legatoria Editoriale Giovanni Olivotto), a family-owned enterprise with nearly 120 years of fine printing and publishing spanning five generations:
http://www.borsaitaliana.it/pro-link/emittenti/lego/lego.en.htm
The issue of this book containing "only" 170 of the 220 tales in the original collection is a non-issue (>37 cronshaw:, >44 SF-72:). If the FS had omitted 3 or 4 of the short stories in 'Dubliners' or 'The Door in the Wall' that would, of course, be inexcusable and detract considerably from each collection of short stories. However, in this collection of 220 tales there is wide variation in their quality, i.e., some are simply not very good. Having a knowledgeable and sympathetic editor cull this collection and select the best of these stories, omitting those of lesser merit, is a huge plus not a minus. Add in a long, informative essay by the translator and editor Royall Tyler which places the historical importance of these tales in context, which increases the literary value of this edition.
Suggesting that this is a suitable candidate as "next year's Free Mystery Book" (>43 folio_books:) would be laughable if it weren't so sad, a result of a pseudo-collector who equates aesthetic merit with price. Similarly, comparing this to 'African Folk Tales' and 'Chinese Folk Tales' - two generic FS books without any special qualities whatsoever (>45 Jayked:), is misguided. A far more accurate comparison (imho) is with the recent FS James Joyce editions of 'Ulysses' and 'Finnegans Wake' , in terms of size and scale of the book, the quality of the book design and illustrations, and the quality of printing and craftsmanship.
It is worth placing this book in the historical context of fine and private press editions of Japanese tales. This genre was first introduced to Western audiences by the storied Japanese publisher Takejiro Hasegawa (1853-1938). From 1885 through the mid-1920s he published French and English language editions of these Japanese tales in editions printed on a crepe-like paper and illustrated with Japanese wood block colour illustrations that are subtle and exquisite. They are also quite expensive, outside the reach of most FS collectors. The most famous (and expensive) of these collections is a 5-volume set translated by Lafcadio Hearn (who also edited the splendid LEC collection 'Kwaidan'), published in the 1920s by Hasegawa, routinely costing between $2,000 to $3,000 in collectible condition (see link). At the other end of the spectrum are a handful of generic trade books (Barnes & Noble, Borders, Waterstones, etc.) which serve the useful purpose of bringing these wonderful tales to a wider audience, but certainly not intended as collectible editions. This new FS edition fills an important collecting void, bringing some of the unique aesthetic qualities of the über-expensive Hasegawa editions to book collectors in a highly pleasing, affordable edition.
https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi=3846407745&clickid=widQKzV...
Finally, I am not insensitive to the issue of price. For many FS collectors this is a bit of a reach and they will have to wait 2 or 3 years, hope that the book is subsequently included in a future FS sale and discounted 20% to 30%, bringing it within monetary reach. Nothing wrong with that if that is what is required to acquire a beautiful and unique FS edition. However, please don't fall into the rabbit-hole being dug by a handful of cynical FS pseudo-collectors who can't afford this book, cannot understand or rationalize the price, and then proceed to backwards-rationalize that this edition simply "isn't very good."
Wrong. It is.
47SF-72
>46 dlphcoracl:
Just some comments on yours, which certainly contains some interesting points:
FS brought up parallels to the Folio myths and legends collection, people on this board then took a look which ones they might mean. Without actually having Japanese Tales, I can only go by the images and the books from the myths and legends collection I already have. The parallels between the later releases (African and Chinese) and this one are - to me - the illustrations, which are different in style than those of older editions I have. It is larger, though. The bindings are different in both cases, older and newer titles in the collection. Personally, I'd say that the book is probably not really in series with the myths and legends so far with regard to its binding etc., but more with regard to its content.
I have a serious problem with any abridgements. The quality of stories in any collection certainly varies, but to a large degree personal interests and tastes play a role there. Especially at this price tag, I would like to have a complete book, then make up my own mind on which stories I consider good or not so good. I also find this disrespectful towards the person who first chose these stories.
As for fine press editions of Japanese tales: You certainly know more about that than me. What has been published recently is a limited edition reprint of the 1910 edition of Green Willow and other Japanese Fairy Tales by Easton Press, illustrated by Warwick Goble. The style is of course quite different from this one by Folio Society, but might interest a similar audience. It's considerably more expensive, though, but then it's rather large, leather-bound, limited, and contains 40 hand-tipped colour illustrations. This just in case anyone's interested in this book.
Just some comments on yours, which certainly contains some interesting points:
FS brought up parallels to the Folio myths and legends collection, people on this board then took a look which ones they might mean. Without actually having Japanese Tales, I can only go by the images and the books from the myths and legends collection I already have. The parallels between the later releases (African and Chinese) and this one are - to me - the illustrations, which are different in style than those of older editions I have. It is larger, though. The bindings are different in both cases, older and newer titles in the collection. Personally, I'd say that the book is probably not really in series with the myths and legends so far with regard to its binding etc., but more with regard to its content.
I have a serious problem with any abridgements. The quality of stories in any collection certainly varies, but to a large degree personal interests and tastes play a role there. Especially at this price tag, I would like to have a complete book, then make up my own mind on which stories I consider good or not so good. I also find this disrespectful towards the person who first chose these stories.
As for fine press editions of Japanese tales: You certainly know more about that than me. What has been published recently is a limited edition reprint of the 1910 edition of Green Willow and other Japanese Fairy Tales by Easton Press, illustrated by Warwick Goble. The style is of course quite different from this one by Folio Society, but might interest a similar audience. It's considerably more expensive, though, but then it's rather large, leather-bound, limited, and contains 40 hand-tipped colour illustrations. This just in case anyone's interested in this book.
48dlphcoracl
>47 SF-72:
In response to your reply:
1. 'Japanese Tales' is decidedly NOT part of the standard FS myths and legends collection and the FS should have worded this differently. I own numerous books in the standard FS 'myths & legends' series and there is no comparison regarding originality of design and book quality between that series and this new FS book.
2. "Abridgement" is the wrong word. To me, an abridgment changes the actual work of literature by shortening or altering it in an inexcusable, "dumbing-down" manner. Selecting the best tales from a very large collection of widely varying quality is precisely what I expect and want an editor to do. Additionally, including all of the 220 tales would have made the book slightly more difficult and uncomfortable to read and handle while further increasing the price of the book (something that is already an issue for several FS book collectors) without improving the literary merit of this collection. Separating the literary wheat from the chaff is hardly "disrespectful" - if a complete collection of the 220 tales is of paramount importance, this is what generic trade books are for.
3. I am decidedly not a fan of most Easton Press and Franklin Library books. However, similar to the FS they do publish special editions that are especially pleasing and their facsimile edition of the classic Japanese collection 'Green Willow & other Japanese Fairy Tales' is one of these special Easton books. The 1910 original limited edition of 500 copies by MacMillan & Co. with Warwick Goble illustrations is a fabulous book and the Easton Press facsimile does justice to it. That said, the Easton facsimile is a limited edition of 1200 copies costing $500, comparable in quality and intent to the FS Limited Editions, and it should certainly be of interest to FSD-ers who are especially interested in collecting this genre.
In response to your reply:
1. 'Japanese Tales' is decidedly NOT part of the standard FS myths and legends collection and the FS should have worded this differently. I own numerous books in the standard FS 'myths & legends' series and there is no comparison regarding originality of design and book quality between that series and this new FS book.
2. "Abridgement" is the wrong word. To me, an abridgment changes the actual work of literature by shortening or altering it in an inexcusable, "dumbing-down" manner. Selecting the best tales from a very large collection of widely varying quality is precisely what I expect and want an editor to do. Additionally, including all of the 220 tales would have made the book slightly more difficult and uncomfortable to read and handle while further increasing the price of the book (something that is already an issue for several FS book collectors) without improving the literary merit of this collection. Separating the literary wheat from the chaff is hardly "disrespectful" - if a complete collection of the 220 tales is of paramount importance, this is what generic trade books are for.
3. I am decidedly not a fan of most Easton Press and Franklin Library books. However, similar to the FS they do publish special editions that are especially pleasing and their facsimile edition of the classic Japanese collection 'Green Willow & other Japanese Fairy Tales' is one of these special Easton books. The 1910 original limited edition of 500 copies by MacMillan & Co. with Warwick Goble illustrations is a fabulous book and the Easton Press facsimile does justice to it. That said, the Easton facsimile is a limited edition of 1200 copies costing $500, comparable in quality and intent to the FS Limited Editions, and it should certainly be of interest to FSD-ers who are especially interested in collecting this genre.
49Jayked
>46 dlphcoracl:
Regarding my "misguided" comparison of Japanese Tales with Chinese Fairy Tales and African Folk Tales: I made no such comparison. I have seen none of these titles. I merely pointed out in response to someone who claimed that JT had nothing in common with any series of folk tales that Folio itself claimed in writing that it did. And that FS had not identified it as a Fine Edition, which it clearly is.
Because your comments come in the middle of a condemnation of those "pseudo-collectors" who value price over quality let me make it clear that I buy books in the Folio Society range regardless of cost if I want them. My only complaint about price is that Folio consistently gouges Canadian clients on the exchange rate. I am not proud that I can afford books that others cannot. And I would consider it ungentlemanly to describe in derogatory terms anyone whose choice is limited by financial considerations.
Regarding my "misguided" comparison of Japanese Tales with Chinese Fairy Tales and African Folk Tales: I made no such comparison. I have seen none of these titles. I merely pointed out in response to someone who claimed that JT had nothing in common with any series of folk tales that Folio itself claimed in writing that it did. And that FS had not identified it as a Fine Edition, which it clearly is.
Because your comments come in the middle of a condemnation of those "pseudo-collectors" who value price over quality let me make it clear that I buy books in the Folio Society range regardless of cost if I want them. My only complaint about price is that Folio consistently gouges Canadian clients on the exchange rate. I am not proud that I can afford books that others cannot. And I would consider it ungentlemanly to describe in derogatory terms anyone whose choice is limited by financial considerations.
50gmacaree
Tempers have been running a little hot here of late, and I think that the FSD forum might be rendered more pleasant if some effort was made to cool things down a bit!
With regards to abridgment, every collection of stories like this is an abridgment of some sort. The 220 stories in the original were culled from the whole corpus of Japanese folk tales (I assume by Royall Tyler, the translator and editor). And since he's writing the introduction to this edition as well one might not feel as though they're going too far out on a limb to suggest that he doesn't feel disrespected by the cuts.
As to whether it's worth the money, I'm planning on ordering next week and finding out for myself. To me it looks like a fine edition, as does the new Bird book, but I understand why there might be some question as to the price tag. If there's interest and if nobody beats me to the punch, I'll share my thoughts when I have books in hand.
With regards to abridgment, every collection of stories like this is an abridgment of some sort. The 220 stories in the original were culled from the whole corpus of Japanese folk tales (I assume by Royall Tyler, the translator and editor). And since he's writing the introduction to this edition as well one might not feel as though they're going too far out on a limb to suggest that he doesn't feel disrespected by the cuts.
As to whether it's worth the money, I'm planning on ordering next week and finding out for myself. To me it looks like a fine edition, as does the new Bird book, but I understand why there might be some question as to the price tag. If there's interest and if nobody beats me to the punch, I'll share my thoughts when I have books in hand.
51dlphcoracl
>49 Jayked:
Try reading my comments again.
I am not belittling FSD collectors whose choices are guided and limited by financial considerations. Rather, I am criticizing the handful of pseudo-collectors for whom this is the overwhelming consideration, then falsely demean the quality and artistic value of a fine press book because they cannot afford it.
P.S. I share your frustration regarding the uneven and inequitable cost of FS books for North American residents vs. those living in the U.K. Australian residents, of course, are even more unfairly affected by this pricing policy.
Try reading my comments again.
I am not belittling FSD collectors whose choices are guided and limited by financial considerations. Rather, I am criticizing the handful of pseudo-collectors for whom this is the overwhelming consideration, then falsely demean the quality and artistic value of a fine press book because they cannot afford it.
P.S. I share your frustration regarding the uneven and inequitable cost of FS books for North American residents vs. those living in the U.K. Australian residents, of course, are even more unfairly affected by this pricing policy.
53Fierylunar
>50 gmacaree: Couldn't agree more with your statements!
Owning and having read a fair part of the Myths and Legends quarterbound leather set I can safely some myths/legends/folk tales could be and/or should be considered for removal. Myths and Legends of Russia was particularly bad at this for me (e.g. The Turnip, p. 13). I'm willing to follow the fair judgement of publishers, especially if the original compiler of the stories was involved when slicing parts of a book. Having said that, I can't say the price tag for this book looks reasonable to me. Do feel free to share your findings after the book is delivered and correct me if I'm wrong!
>51 dlphcoracl: This discussion is approaching arguments used in Apple vs Android fanboys flame wars ("You can't afford my new gadget so you're hating on me!" meets "Oh come on, what's so special about that?"). Discussions like that rarely result in anything else than arguments ad hominem and trolling. To you, your comments read like fair criticism. To me, they look to be on the fine line between that and insulting other valued members of this community. Others might feel attacked by them.
Word of advice for anyone who's willing to take it: if a discussion bothers you too much, step away for a while and leave it be. It's not worth the time and energy you could be putting into reducing that TBR pile ;-)
Owning and having read a fair part of the Myths and Legends quarterbound leather set I can safely some myths/legends/folk tales could be and/or should be considered for removal. Myths and Legends of Russia was particularly bad at this for me (e.g. The Turnip, p. 13). I'm willing to follow the fair judgement of publishers, especially if the original compiler of the stories was involved when slicing parts of a book. Having said that, I can't say the price tag for this book looks reasonable to me. Do feel free to share your findings after the book is delivered and correct me if I'm wrong!
>51 dlphcoracl: This discussion is approaching arguments used in Apple vs Android fanboys flame wars ("You can't afford my new gadget so you're hating on me!" meets "Oh come on, what's so special about that?"). Discussions like that rarely result in anything else than arguments ad hominem and trolling. To you, your comments read like fair criticism. To me, they look to be on the fine line between that and insulting other valued members of this community. Others might feel attacked by them.
Word of advice for anyone who's willing to take it: if a discussion bothers you too much, step away for a while and leave it be. It's not worth the time and energy you could be putting into reducing that TBR pile ;-)
54Levin40
>52 drasvola: Completely agree. There's little more yawn-inducing than someone who accuses others of being 'pseudo-whatevers', presumably in an effort to emphasise their own apparent superiority.
As a little thought experiment, if FS had decided to cut 100 of the 220 tales, and charge £150 for the book, would the subject be acceptable for debate then?
On the plus side, fantastic news that LT is up again and we can continue these fascinating discussions. The enforced downtime almost encouraged me to open a book instead :-)
As a little thought experiment, if FS had decided to cut 100 of the 220 tales, and charge £150 for the book, would the subject be acceptable for debate then?
On the plus side, fantastic news that LT is up again and we can continue these fascinating discussions. The enforced downtime almost encouraged me to open a book instead :-)
55folio_books
>53 Fierylunar: if a discussion bothers you too much, step away for a while and leave it be. It's not worth the time and energy you could be putting into reducing that TBR pile ;-)
Couldn't agree more. Fanning the flames will achieve nothing. Personally I come here for relaxation and enjoyable conversation with like-minded people, and no individual is going to put me off that.
Here's a hint. If anyone really doesn't like where I'm coming from, block me. It's a very useful facility. I haven't used it very much but it's very effective at keeping my blood pressure down.
Couldn't agree more. Fanning the flames will achieve nothing. Personally I come here for relaxation and enjoyable conversation with like-minded people, and no individual is going to put me off that.
Here's a hint. If anyone really doesn't like where I'm coming from, block me. It's a very useful facility. I haven't used it very much but it's very effective at keeping my blood pressure down.
56harvestRoad
dlphcoracl:
Mwah!
Mwah!
57cronshaw
>46 dlphcoracl: Is it really necessary to disparage those who happen to have different perspectives and opinions to you?
As someone who's content to be a lowly avid reader and doesn't remotely envision himself as a superior collector of fine and private press books (or even a 'pseudo-collector'), I prefer to trust the editing work of the eminent Japanese cultural expert and linguist Royall Tyler here and enjoy all 220 tales he selected for the Penguin Random House first edition, which has received uniformly glowing reviews, none of which mentions that almost one quarter of the tales are duds. If you prefer to have the prettier binding and die-cut slipcase but with almost a quarter of Tyler's tales chopped (perhaps to meet the £75 'fine editions' price point) so be it. The Folio edition is certainly a most handsomely bound and presented volume. If it had been the full collection of 220 tales as originally edited by Tyler and priced at £100 it would have been far more appealing to me.
Re your: 'Add in a long, informative essay by the translator and editor Royall Tyler which places the historical importance of these tales in context, which increases the literary value of this edition'. The Penguin Random House edition has a very long informative introductory essay by Royall Tyler that describes in considerable detail the context and historical importance of the tales. If Folio had commissioned a new introduction from him, then that would almost certainly have received mention in the FS marketing blurb. It hasn't, so I doubt that the literary value of the Folio edition is increased over the previous one, which by virtue of having all 220 tales originally selected by Tyler would actually carry the greater literary value.
As someone who's content to be a lowly avid reader and doesn't remotely envision himself as a superior collector of fine and private press books (or even a 'pseudo-collector'), I prefer to trust the editing work of the eminent Japanese cultural expert and linguist Royall Tyler here and enjoy all 220 tales he selected for the Penguin Random House first edition, which has received uniformly glowing reviews, none of which mentions that almost one quarter of the tales are duds. If you prefer to have the prettier binding and die-cut slipcase but with almost a quarter of Tyler's tales chopped (perhaps to meet the £75 'fine editions' price point) so be it. The Folio edition is certainly a most handsomely bound and presented volume. If it had been the full collection of 220 tales as originally edited by Tyler and priced at £100 it would have been far more appealing to me.
Re your: 'Add in a long, informative essay by the translator and editor Royall Tyler which places the historical importance of these tales in context, which increases the literary value of this edition'. The Penguin Random House edition has a very long informative introductory essay by Royall Tyler that describes in considerable detail the context and historical importance of the tales. If Folio had commissioned a new introduction from him, then that would almost certainly have received mention in the FS marketing blurb. It hasn't, so I doubt that the literary value of the Folio edition is increased over the previous one, which by virtue of having all 220 tales originally selected by Tyler would actually carry the greater literary value.
58elladan0891
>50 gmacaree:
Hear, hear!
If there's interest and if nobody beats me to the punch, I'll share my thoughts when I have books in hand
Please do! I'm definitely interested.
I certainly wouldn't call this an abridgment. It's explicitly not an abridgment according to some dictionary definitions, and implicitly by others. It's a collection of unabridged stories. Sure, it's a smaller collection than the previously published collection of stories selected by Tyler. But in my view, a hundred and friggin' forty stories are more than enough to give anyone a good taste of Japanese medieval short tales. Sure, I can imagine fans and scholars of Heian literature wishing to get as many stories as they could get their hands on, but I suspect that's a small minority of potential customers. I actually have a paperback with Tyler's larger collection (haven't read it yet), and will most likely replace it with the Folio edition.
Hear, hear!
If there's interest and if nobody beats me to the punch, I'll share my thoughts when I have books in hand
Please do! I'm definitely interested.
I certainly wouldn't call this an abridgment. It's explicitly not an abridgment according to some dictionary definitions, and implicitly by others. It's a collection of unabridged stories. Sure, it's a smaller collection than the previously published collection of stories selected by Tyler. But in my view, a hundred and friggin' forty stories are more than enough to give anyone a good taste of Japanese medieval short tales. Sure, I can imagine fans and scholars of Heian literature wishing to get as many stories as they could get their hands on, but I suspect that's a small minority of potential customers. I actually have a paperback with Tyler's larger collection (haven't read it yet), and will most likely replace it with the Folio edition.
59elladan0891
>53 Fierylunar:
The editor responsible for Myths and Legends of Russia should be sent to Siberia. The book's contents are completely in odds with other books in the series. No medieval epics there, no Bylinas. Instead, it's an edition of fairy and folk tales collected/selected by Alexander Afanasyev in the 19th century. It's like publishing Myths and Legends of Germany consisting of Grimm fairy tales.
Also interesting you mentioned The Turnip. I assume it's the story about a gigantic turnip that goes through several iterations of pulling attempts by a growing crowd of characters. Every Russian knows the story, although in a different version, as it's one of the most popular and standard stories for the earliest ages, and I mean The Very Hungry Caterpillar kind of early. Always illustrated in published forms, the story is cumulative - perfect for the little ones, features characters with rhyming names, teaches teamwork and the value that even the small and the weak can provide to the team (the turnip is eventually pulled from the ground when a little mouse joins in). However, the version published by Afanasyev is odd and puzzling, and is usually not included in collections of Afanasyev's fairy tales published in Russia. Ask a number of random Russians if they know the Turnip fairy tale - all would say yes, but then give them Afanasyev's version to read, and I'm willing to bet some very good money that reaction of all of them would be in the WTF category.
The editor responsible for Myths and Legends of Russia should be sent to Siberia. The book's contents are completely in odds with other books in the series. No medieval epics there, no Bylinas. Instead, it's an edition of fairy and folk tales collected/selected by Alexander Afanasyev in the 19th century. It's like publishing Myths and Legends of Germany consisting of Grimm fairy tales.
Also interesting you mentioned The Turnip. I assume it's the story about a gigantic turnip that goes through several iterations of pulling attempts by a growing crowd of characters. Every Russian knows the story, although in a different version, as it's one of the most popular and standard stories for the earliest ages, and I mean The Very Hungry Caterpillar kind of early. Always illustrated in published forms, the story is cumulative - perfect for the little ones, features characters with rhyming names, teaches teamwork and the value that even the small and the weak can provide to the team (the turnip is eventually pulled from the ground when a little mouse joins in). However, the version published by Afanasyev is odd and puzzling, and is usually not included in collections of Afanasyev's fairy tales published in Russia. Ask a number of random Russians if they know the Turnip fairy tale - all would say yes, but then give them Afanasyev's version to read, and I'm willing to bet some very good money that reaction of all of them would be in the WTF category.
60Fierylunar
>59 elladan0891: interesting reply, thank you! I enjoyed reading that ;)
"reaction of all of them would be in the WTF category" Luckily, I'm in good company apparently. And here I thought it was just me...
"reaction of all of them would be in the WTF category" Luckily, I'm in good company apparently. And here I thought it was just me...
61harvestRoad
Man, that is woeful to read about the russian myths and legends. Hopefully they'll publish a Russian Tales soon
62gmacaree
I just received Japanese Tales, The Yangtze Valley and Beyond and The Snow Leopard. Thoughts!
Japanese Tales. There's been debate over whether this is a "fine edition" or not. The answer is yes. The production values are significantly higher than the average Folio book. The silver gilded page tops and ribbon marker work in harmony with the binding, which I'm very much taken by. It's a nice, coarse book cloth, a very pleasant tactile experience. The endpapers are also striking, and I love Yuko Shimizu's big illustrations. Having skimmed the introduction, it seems scholarly, detailed and valuable, but I suspect it's not a new one, so that's neither here nor there.
I'm less positive about the black and white illustrations that have been mentioned in the thread already. They're used as cute markers for tale chapters -- I'd guess 30-40 percent of them have some B/W illustrations attached. But they're often re-used rather than unique, which takes away some of the effect. Perhaps there's a code here that I won't understand until I read it properly. The paper is also a little thinner than I'd like, but not annoyingly so. My glance through the book has shed no light on why some of the tales have been cut.
All in all, I think a solid effort at the price point, but not a better purchase than e.g. the recent Bergerac at £60. Any significant discount would push this into must-buy territory.
The Yangtze Valley and Beyond. Wow. The binding is a shimmery silken thing, seductive to sight and touch. It's far more impressive in person than on the screen. The lack of interesting endpapers is more than made up for by the map, which I haven't seen outside Travels in Arabia Deserta. Obviously this one isn't as impressive as in the Doughty, which was my favourite part of an incredible LE, but it's still very good, bigger than I expected. I anticipate that it will be a valuable guide as I read. The photos and paper are both marvellous.
For £75, I think you're getting more here than Japanese Tales, assuming the subject matter is of interest.
The Snow Leopard.
I'm more impressed by the binding than I thought I'd be. While I don't love the brown palette, it works better up close than on the pictures, and the treatment Folio have given the text on the front cover (they seem to have used some sort of variable-opacity plastic) is rather fetching. Endpapers are detailed maps, which I appreciate, and there are plenty of nice touches inside the book itself as well.
I'd suggest that this one is on the higher end of 'standard' Folio editions.
Japanese Tales. There's been debate over whether this is a "fine edition" or not. The answer is yes. The production values are significantly higher than the average Folio book. The silver gilded page tops and ribbon marker work in harmony with the binding, which I'm very much taken by. It's a nice, coarse book cloth, a very pleasant tactile experience. The endpapers are also striking, and I love Yuko Shimizu's big illustrations. Having skimmed the introduction, it seems scholarly, detailed and valuable, but I suspect it's not a new one, so that's neither here nor there.
I'm less positive about the black and white illustrations that have been mentioned in the thread already. They're used as cute markers for tale chapters -- I'd guess 30-40 percent of them have some B/W illustrations attached. But they're often re-used rather than unique, which takes away some of the effect. Perhaps there's a code here that I won't understand until I read it properly. The paper is also a little thinner than I'd like, but not annoyingly so. My glance through the book has shed no light on why some of the tales have been cut.
All in all, I think a solid effort at the price point, but not a better purchase than e.g. the recent Bergerac at £60. Any significant discount would push this into must-buy territory.
The Yangtze Valley and Beyond. Wow. The binding is a shimmery silken thing, seductive to sight and touch. It's far more impressive in person than on the screen. The lack of interesting endpapers is more than made up for by the map, which I haven't seen outside Travels in Arabia Deserta. Obviously this one isn't as impressive as in the Doughty, which was my favourite part of an incredible LE, but it's still very good, bigger than I expected. I anticipate that it will be a valuable guide as I read. The photos and paper are both marvellous.
For £75, I think you're getting more here than Japanese Tales, assuming the subject matter is of interest.
The Snow Leopard.
I'm more impressed by the binding than I thought I'd be. While I don't love the brown palette, it works better up close than on the pictures, and the treatment Folio have given the text on the front cover (they seem to have used some sort of variable-opacity plastic) is rather fetching. Endpapers are detailed maps, which I appreciate, and there are plenty of nice touches inside the book itself as well.
I'd suggest that this one is on the higher end of 'standard' Folio editions.
64NLNils
>62 gmacaree: Thanks for your insights, well appreciated!
65venkysuniverse
>62 gmacaree: Thanks for the feedback.
66elladan0891
>62 gmacaree: ...map, which I haven't seen outside Travels in Arabia Deserta
There is also a map in Hide and Seek, comes folded in a sleeve attached to the back board.
And another thank you for sharing your impressions.
There is also a map in Hide and Seek, comes folded in a sleeve attached to the back board.
And another thank you for sharing your impressions.
67EclecticIndulgence
This message has been deleted by its author.
68olepuppy
Folded maps are included, no sleeve, with A Secret Pilgrimage to Mecca and Medina and Into the Dark Continent in the adventure series. Nice touch.
69housefulofpaper
A map was loosely inserted (is "laid in" the correct phrase?) in The Source of the Nile back in 1993.
70cronshaw
>62 gmacaree: Many thanks for the further detailed information!
>69 housefulofpaper: Into the Dark Continent (2002) also has a folded map laid in at the back.
>69 housefulofpaper: Into the Dark Continent (2002) also has a folded map laid in at the back.
72cyber_naut
Has anyone purchased this since the recent reprint? I’m interested in ordering a copy but wonder if there’s been any change since the first run.
Also, can any owners comment on the slipcase quality? It looks rather thin and ‘cheap’ on the folio site.
Also, can any owners comment on the slipcase quality? It looks rather thin and ‘cheap’ on the folio site.